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official "ask ethnocide+others" thread (muscle + fitness)
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Author:  Mr C. [ 03 Aug 2009, 07:48 ]
Post subject:  official "ask ethnocide+others" thread (muscle + fitness)

since we have a resident "expert" on the issue of bulking up, we may well stick all his advice in one place. These were in the "best of";

No gym or weights needed. Body weight, body movement, and anything you can lift around your home will suffice. If you can find something to support your weight, chin ups are huge. Even if you can't do one, you can practice holding the bar for as long as you can. Body weight squats/lunges, push ups (you can use stairs, or your bed for an incline if you can't do a proper one.) jumping squats, you can dead-lift lift your bed. These combined with HIIT style cardio and eating healthy. HIIT cardio for a beginner is basically walk 2 minutes, jog 2 minutes, full-sprint 30sec-1min. Do this for 20-30 minutes. This style of cardio is better than keeping a constant pace because it causes your body to burn more calories for hours afterward. This is especially useful in the mornings. Drink a gallon of water a day (or work up to it)

So you could shoot for 200 reps total. You could do 50 total pushups (or girl pushups, or incline ones if you need until you work up to normal pushup) 50 bodyweight lunges (or you can find something in your house to hold up while doing them for better effect) 50 jumping squats, and dead lift your bed 50 times. Break all these up into sets according to whatever you are physically capable of at the time.

I would suggest trying for the sleep problem. There is a chance that the body's need for rest will overpower whatever it is that's causing you not to sleep. Of course, I don't know the specifics of your condition. I would still say it's worth a try.

I have to add:

If your body type is really skinny

- Skip/reduce the cardio (1-2 times/week max. Otherwise you are wasting time)

- Consume more calories than you spend. (Eat a lot, this is of the upmost importance)

- Try to consume grams of protein = to your body weight in lbs daily (or more).

- DON'T do the cardio on the same day as your lifting. The body will take more from your muscle, you will be wasting time.

- Add an extra lifting session or two throughout the week. Try to find something heavy in your house to clean lift over your head. You should only be able to do it 4-5 times. If you can do it 12 times, it's not heavy enough.

If your body type is fatter:

- Add 2-4 more cardio sessions throughout the week.

- DO the cardio in the morning, on the same day as lifting.

- Add another 200 rep session to your week.

- Most importantly, consume less calories than you expend.

- Try to eat 4-5-6 smaller meals/day. Keep the protein high, but don't need to go crazy about it until you are thinned out and ready to gain lean muscle mass.

To all:

2 DAYS OF REST (no exercise at all) / WEEK AND PLENTY OF SLEEP. (at east 7-8 hrs)

I know there are some more advice posts out there. If anybody finds anything else Ethnocide (or anyone) writes on this topic, copy and paste in this thread. Also, if anybody has any questions for Ethnocide on this issue, post it here, (or don't and I'll just move it here if I can figure out how with my mod capabilities). I figure if it's all in one place, I'll read it over 500 times and MAYBE, just maybe DO something one of these days...

Author:  Mr C. [ 04 Aug 2009, 06:19 ]
Post subject:  Re: the official "ask ethnocide" thread (bulking up)

more quotes, including some from NewHope.

NewHope wrote:
Mesian wrote:
yeah but I just seem to hit some plateau... maybe i will do like 15 minutes at the beginning and end of the day next time, that would be a start and it would produce less strain, else my arms just hurt like a motherfucker :lol:

New weight trainers need to work out with LIGHT weights for around 2 weeks. Once you're body gets used to it, then start lifting progressively heavier weights. Eventually you will have better muscular endurance and within a month, you could do a full-hour, real workout.

The kicker is this, though: Muscle soreness is the norm for a real muscle-gaining program. Expect to feel slightly sore for about 24 hours in all muscle groups worked after a session. This is why rest is essential. A previous poster is spot on about how that sorness is microtears in the tissue. By not working out until your sorness is gone, or 48 hours later -- whichever is longer -- and loading up on good protein (milk and tuna are your best friends) during your rest days, you are building new muscle.

Ethnocide wrote:
Mesian wrote:
no, eggs and meat are the best

there's too much salt and other bullshit in tuna, and modern milk is stripped off of all its good nutriments, raw milk is illegal

Whey protein, organic eggs with water, hemp bread, Oats, Fibre, lean red meats, organic chicken and turkey. Fill up on the whey shakes before and after lifting heavy weights. This is pretty well all I eat in an average day.

Give 48 hrs at least in between lifting for sure. In fact, when I was starting I had to wait like 4-5 days before the soreness would go away. I had intense lifting sessions though.

If you can get in some glutamine that really cuts down on the muscle regrowth time, and makes it more efficient too.

Author:  Mav998 [ 08 Aug 2009, 08:55 ]
Post subject:  Re: the official "ask ethnocide" thread (bulking up)

I generally agree with Ethnocide on most of his comments. If others are interested in advice, I am also willing to answer a bit. I am certified as a personal trainer myself as a hobby or even occupation (since economy is going sour).

Author:  NewHope [ 09 Aug 2009, 13:30 ]
Post subject:  Re: the official "ask ethnocide" thread (bulking up)

Very wise decision :). For those who are not LS/incel because of shyness or other reasons, personal fitness is absolutely vital in overcoming that condition.

Author:  Lord Epic [ 14 Aug 2009, 18:41 ]
Post subject:  Bodybuilding and fitness

merged from your original 'body building and fitness' topic - ec

I want to throw this into the pot as an important means to recovery. By bodybuilding I do not mean obsessively pumping illegal and dangerous steroids. I mean a programme of excercise, weightlifting, nutrition with a view to attaining an aesthetically pleasing body shape and vastly increased strength. I have been doing this, and martial arts, for some years but had lapsed (pressure of work, too much free alcohol etc). I have been very diligent over the last couple of years having been initially coaxed by a friend. So why do it ?

1 - You look better. MUCH better. Anyone can get a better shape - it is just a question of hard work and time. I am naturally thin and weedy but now have considerable strengh and I am getting progressively stronger.

2 - Physical strength vastly increases self esteem and confidence. It is not an automatic cure to LS but I am sure it helps.

3 - Women notice muscles. OK, some prefer weedy blokes but they are a minority so sod them.

4 - Most so called "alpha" males are not that strong. I am not at all aggressive but a karate kick from me would be fatal and they know it - I can tell by the way they look at me. I stress, strength must not be used aggressively but you have the power anyway. It is a bit like driving a Ferrari at 55 mph in a 55 mph zone.

5 - There is nothing wrong with being a narcissist ! I have actually made two lesbians laugh their t*ts off when I told them about me standing in front of a mirror narcissisticly counting all my muscles. Look, they are gay anyway so I may as well make them laugh.

6 - Finally, use your strength to help. Offer to help a young mother with a pushchair. Carry an old ladies shopping. Help a wheelchair bound man off a train.

I hope this helps. Get Lifting !

Author:  Ethnocide [ 15 Aug 2009, 02:44 ]
Post subject:  Re: the official "ask ethnocide" thread (bulking up)

Is there anything you guys don't agree with that I said? I am still learning too. I'd like to improve upon what I know now.

Author:  Lord Epic [ 16 Aug 2009, 16:43 ]
Post subject:  Re: the official "ask ethnocide" thread (bulking up)

Ethnocide wrote:
Is there anything you guys don't agree with that I said? I am still learning too. I'd like to improve upon what I know now.

To add a bit more detail to what has been said.

1 - If you have the money then join a gym and get a personal trainer, at least for a programme of sessions to get you started.

2 - There are a whole range of supplements (whey protein etc) but they are expensive.

3 - Look at Youtube for instructional videos. Many are excellent.

4 - "Muscle and Fitness" magazine is excellent and full of good advice on technique and nutrition. I think it is available in US as well as UK.

5 - The science is that when muscles are stressed the tubules break down and are then repaired with new muscle added. This is why the same muscles must not be stressed for at least 2 days and better still, 3 days. You can excercise specific muscle groups on different days such as biceps, triceps, abdominals, chest, legs. This way you always allow muscles to repair/increase.

6 - Keep a detailed log of what excercise you have done and weights lifted. Gradually increase the amount of weight you shift. Over time you can look at the log and will see the progress you have made (I keep a chart for this so I can easily see how the weights moved have increased).

Author:  Ethnocide [ 19 Aug 2009, 19:18 ]
Post subject:  Re: the official "ask ethnocide" thread (bulking up)

This is the best free set of instructional videos I've seen on the internet so far. The following is for people with or without a gym membership. If you don't like the gym because you are shy, you don't need it. I suggest getting a couple of dumbells, 5lb/10lb for 15-20 bucks. On Ebay you can buy old weight sets for cheap too. ... muscle.htm

You put in your weight and height, and it tells you exactly what to do, from nutrition to training.

You can choose the burn fat/gain muscle plan, or the just gain muscle plan if you are too skinny.

If you don't have the weights at home to do some of the "group A" exercises, put some stuff on a couch to make it heavy, and clean lift it over your head. Not the whole couch, just one end of it. You can also use paint cans, or buckets of water, and do military presses, seated or standing. <--- military press with normal weights. Can be improvised with buckets of water or paint cans. Just hold the handles and lift.

Author:  Lord Epic [ 30 Aug 2009, 11:44 ]
Post subject:  Re: the official "ask ethnocide" thread (bulking up)

Can we not change the name of this thread to something a bit clearer ? To newcomers it is not that obvious what this is. Bulking up is a misnomer as that is only part of the process.

How about "Bodybuilding" or "Muscles and fitness"

Author:  acorn [ 30 Aug 2009, 21:51 ]
Post subject:  Re: the official "ask ethnocide" thread (bulking up)

"Can we not change the name of this thread to something a bit clearer ?
How about "Bodybuilding" or "Muscles and fitness", - I think this would be a good idea alright.
After a 10 year absence I'm starting back weight training on Tuesday as part of a weight loss program, looking forward to it :) .

Author:  Ethnocide [ 30 Aug 2009, 23:04 ]
Post subject:  Re: the official "ask ethnocide" thread (bulking up)

acorn wrote:
"Can we not change the name of this thread to something a bit clearer ?
How about "Bodybuilding" or "Muscles and fitness", - I think this would be a good idea alright.
After a 10 year absence I'm starting back weight training on Tuesday as part of a weight loss program, looking forward to it :) .

Good to hear. Yeah bulking up is one aspect of training, Muscle and Fitness would be cool. Most people I've heard from on here just want to lose a little fat and maybe build a bit of muscle, just to improve the general look of their body, so "Muscle and Fitness" would be better than "Bodybuilding".

Author:  Lord Epic [ 31 Aug 2009, 00:13 ]
Post subject:  Re: the official "ask ethnocide" thread (bulking up)

Ethnocide wrote:
acorn wrote:
"Can we not change the name of this thread to something a bit clearer ?
How about "Bodybuilding" or "Muscles and fitness", - I think this would be a good idea alright.
After a 10 year absence I'm starting back weight training on Tuesday as part of a weight loss program, looking forward to it :) .

Good to hear. Yeah bulking up is one aspect of training, Muscle and Fitness would be cool. Most people I've heard from on here just want to lose a little fat and maybe build a bit of muscle, just to improve the general look of their body, so "Muscle and Fitness" would be better than "Bodybuilding".

Great - we can ask empty thingmy. Btw, this is the body I think we should all be aiming for (I mean we want to look like this, not we want Anthony Keidis in a homo-erotic sense) ... -chest.jpg

Author:  Mr C. [ 31 Aug 2009, 00:19 ]
Post subject:  Re: the official "ask ethnocide" thread (muscle + fitness)

thread title changed. I'm keeping Ethnocide's name in the title, since he's the guy who talks most about this. But anybody is free (and encouraged) to give input.

Author:  Mr C. [ 18 Sep 2009, 08:23 ]
Post subject:  Re: the official "ask ethnocide" thread (muscle + fitness)

a couple of long, informative posts by "NewHope";

For the record, CWL is absolutely correct in his obervations in that post of his he quoted. Many InCels out there have a certain combination of false belifs that work together in deadly synergy, therefore insuring that they will remain single for a looooooong time. Let's take a look at these three dangerous myths and how they interrelate to leave you one confused, frustrated motherfucker with a 20+ year case of chronic blue balls. Before I get started, let me make this clear that this applies to people who are InCel and not LoveShy. Anyhow, here are the myths:

1. "Looks don't matter"
2. "I'm attractive"
3. "My problem is social skills or some other internal factor"

Myth #1: Looks Dont Matter That Much

It's bloody obvious the contrary view is more accurate for fuck's sake...look around you and try to objectively observe how people behave, all while temporarily suspending in your mind all mantras, axioms and other cultural conditioning. Ignore the words and watch the actions. Sure there are SOME girls who will date a guy way less attractive than themselves, but observe people, really observe'll see, plain as day, that those are the EXCEPTION not the rule. Observing human dating/mating behavoir should also make it pretty clear to you that the better you look, the more flaws people in general are willing to overlook. Convincing yourself that Myth #1 is true prevents you from putting in the time and effort to allow you to have that one thing to offer that, in reality, matters the most wether we like it or not.

Myth #2:

Ok, folks, how many times do you see ugly guys out there listing "attractiveness" as one of their positive traits and you hope he didn't notice you roll your eyes the second he said that? You think you're attractive just because a few girls told you you were "cute"? Lots of girls out there make it a point to tell ugly guys that, thinking their doing the guy a favor by making him feel better. The problem is that these guys really believe it. I used to get called "cute" or "nice looking" ALL THE FRIGGIN TIME, but yet I remained an InCel despite my best efforts for many years. Only after I started bodybuilding as a hobby did I finally start getting dates. Please try to explain away that one :).
Don't shoot the messenger, but if you are putting yourself out there, meeting people, doing things and still not getting dates, you are most certainly not attractive to the vast majority of people and those girls' compliments on your looks were pity compliments because you're such a nice guy and she feels bad for you.
Convincing yourself that Myth #2 is true leads you to further convince yourself that Myth #1 is true, which even further prevents you from putting in the effort and time needed to have on offfer the most important dating requirement. One-Two punch...ouch! A typical thought process of someone who belives these two myths in combination goes like this:
1. "I'm attractive, yet I still don't get dates, therefore looks don't matter"
2. "The girl I'm interested in passed me over for this jerk, so she must not like nice guys"
In point 1, the irony is that he only THINKS he's attractive. In point 2, we see the common "nice guy vs bad boy" phenomenon so many guys bitch about. The really is that it doesn't even have jack shit to do with personality traits! The real battle going on here isn't between nice vs mean, but good looking vs plain looking. When given a chance, a girl will date a nice guy IN A HEARTBEAT, provided he is ALSO PHYSICALLY ATTRACTIVE to her. Understand that for most people who have anything at all to offer, the dividing factor between a friendship and a relationship is sexuality.
If you keep repeating a pattern of your love interests always wanting to just be your friend, it's a safe bet that your problem is your looks, even if she tells you you're "cute" in an attempt to soften the blow to your ego she just gave you. You should know that's a bullshit complimant given out of pity because, more than anything, women want a guy that's both physically attractive AND NICE. Since she already likes you as a friend, if she really found you attractive physically, believe me, she would be all over your ass like flies on shit. She most certainly would not let an opportunity to go out with you pass her by!!

Myth #3: My problem is social skills or some other internal factor.

If you already believe the previous 2 myths, then it logically follows that you will come to believe this to be your main problem since it's "not" your looks. Newsflash: Many "hot" typically have the WORST social skills and the MOST internal baggage!! Let me repeat that again for absolute clarity:

Many "hot" typically have the WORST social skills and the MOST internal baggage.
Many "hot" typically have the WORST social skills and the MOST internal baggage.
Many "hot" typically have the WORST social skills and the MOST internal baggage.
Many "hot" typically have the WORST social skills and the MOST internal baggage.

.....ok. ok, you get the point. I'll stop. Anyhow....

Yes, it's true, and I say this as someone who hangs out with a lot of "studs" as friends. Yes, they may be confident and not shy, but beyond that they're actually more like "nerds" dressed in a different package. The only reason they don't exhibit any typical "creepy" behavior is because their reality is such that the girls are interested in the first place and if not, there's pleny of girls out there that are and they know it from past, proven experience. Having said that, though, you should see what happens to Mr. Stud when he falls in love and then gets dumped. I've witness all manner of needy, needy, WUSSY behavior patterns! Imagine, if you will, a male model that all the girls just go apeshit over, crying and BEGGING the girl to take him back while leaving 15 messages. This actually happened. The guy is an old friend and the girl happens to be my sister. This isn't an isolated incident, either, but a common trend.
All the so called "creepy" behavior girls attribute to ugly guys isn't the cause of their involuntary celibacy, but the inevitable result of it. Having very little dating experience doesn't give you much of a benchmark to better determine between interest and non-interest, giving you the ability to know how to act and when to do what.
Convincing yourself that Myth #3 is true causes you to focus all your self-improvement engery on something that won't really help you that much in the long run, while outright neglecting the very thing that WILL help you (dramaticly improving your looks with strict diet, short duration, high inensity weight training and fashion/hygeine overhaul). Myth #2 ("I'm attractive") leads into Myth #3 (My problem is social skills/etc), indirectly reinforcing Myth #1 (Looks don't matter that much). See the diabolical synergy at work?

This is why I am concerned for the well-being of the incel board members. Though well-meaning in their own, misguided way, they promote some very sweet tasting yet ultimately damaging ideas about attraction that, when added together, create a vicious cycle where each belief reinforces the other as their experiences in the dating world are interpreted according to these axioms/mental filters. The PC stuff they push is the very thing that's keeping them down because in order for an InCel guy to break free, he must accept 3 uncomfortable, painful and politically incorrect truths:

1. Looks are CRITICAL to attraction!!
2. I'm NOT attractive. This is the primary reason I don't get dates.
3. Many women tell plain looking guys they are attractive, thinking their doing him a favor by "boosting his self esteem".

Combine that with one final truth:

4. Good looks are MADE, not freely given to you in the womb as is the common belief.

With those 4 new ideas, I garun-motherfucking-tee you'll blast through that InCel wall, guns blazing, to meet your own personal harem on the other side of it, symbolicly speaking. If that doesn't give you enough motivation to eat brown rice and chicken instead of pizza while busting your ass HARD in the gym 3 days a week, an hour at a time (30 second breaks between sets, running all excercises in circuit fashion -- high volume, short duration), then I don't know what is. Here's another bonus, meet plenty of new people at the gym. Eventually those new people will be mostly girls as you start looking better.

On point #3, I'm not going to mention any names, but I've seen that shit a few times over in the picture thread and kept quiet about it. Yes, there are some decent looking guys, but with others, the pity compliments from the female members were pretty friggin obvious.

Hi Seb

I highly encourage you to get out there and whip yourself into shape and also try some style/fashion tips. Those two things did so much for me in the dating world it is absolutely beyond belief. Seriously, I will stand behind you all the way if you decide to finally do it. Yes, it's a shallow world out there, but if you play by their unwritten, unspoken rules and given 'em what they want, the rewards for your hard work and dedication will be immense. That is the "New Hope Makeover System (TM) Money-Back, No Questions Asked Garuntee". Hey....I just got an idea for a profitable online ebook hehe :).
Anyhow, if you decide to bear down and get serious, you can PM me anytime you have questions regarding weight training, proper diet for fitness and fashion/style.

A few points to get you started...start out light on the weights because you will be sore after every workout for the first month, but you will get more and more accoustomed to it each time. Also, grab yourself a copy of Tom Venuto's ebook "burn the fat, feed the muscle" (or I could just email you a copy of my own copy and save you the $40 lol). His book is the best I've seen for advice that actually works for people that are not professional bodybuilders coked up on 'roids. He focuses very heavily on proper diet and metabolism boosting tips as you cannot exercise out an improper diet. I don't agree with everything he says, but in most areas, the man is absolutely bang-on correct.

Also, never underestimate the value of bodyweight exercises in scultping your body and getting toned. Here is a good site to get you started:
You don't need to buy weights for that and they are perfect fat burner - muscle builders for beginners (although for serious lean mass increases, weights are king). I highly advocate doing burpees...just 10 reps of those and most people who don't exercise much are already gasping for breath. Work your way up to where you can do 100 a day in 10-rep spurts. First thing in the morning, drop and do 10. Just before you leave the house to run an errand, drop and do 10. After you take a shit, drop and do another 10 (lol). Just before bedtime, drop and do 10. Then do 20-rep 200/day. I hate running and cardio, so I do burpees instead. They're like a cross between cardio and light weight tranining.
Here is an example of what burpees are: When you get really good with those and have been working on the chest muscles a bit, you can do the pushup part with one hand instead of two for added resistance (otherwise they're too easy to work the chest anymore).

I also like dumbell lunges quite a lot for beginners as they work the legs and lower-body exercises are KEY to body recomposition (less bodyfat and more lean mass). The legs are a large muscle group, therefore working them heavily slams your metabolism into 5th gear. I have an approach to dumbell lunges that let you work the hell out of your legs without having to hit the squat rack at a gym.
Here's what a dumbell lunge looks like:
Once your body gets used to exercise, do those with a twist....get yourself a set of adjustable dumbells and load those suckers with 25-lb plates. You want to put on enough weight on those dumbells so that you can only do 6 with each leg and cannot do a 7th. As a side benefit, you will work your arms a little, too, as they need to be able to hold the weight.

For body transformation without 'roids, very high intensity in a short time is the way to go. This is why sprinters are often quite buff while marathon runners are often skinny little faggots hehe. You don't need to spend hours and hours in the gym to beef up your "1-10 score" by at least 3-4 points. Tack on a good sense of style and fashion and that's another 2 points. Yes, any dud can become a stud. I do not believe otherwise. Seb, there is indeed a way out of InCel Hell. I feel for you and I understand exactly what it's like being an "older" InCel. I'm in my thirties myself and have only very recently began having dating success.

One fashion tip I can tell you after having seen your photo a while back...shave your head completely. Seriously. I'm wearing the "Vin Diesel Hairdo" myself as I type this, and believe me, being completely bald has not hampered my luck with the ladies. It's actually a rather stylish look and will give your persona a little extra edge. People say "oh but you have to had the right head shape for that". Lol...I don't have the "right" head shape for that, either (flat back of the head and high forhead), but again, it hasn't hurt my luck with women any. Besides, "no" hair is better looking to the women than "a little" hair.

Having said all this...if you want to get serious and actually get the ball rolling on that transformation, I shall leave this parting thought. You have one thing going for you that will help a lot. I remember you said you were in your 40's and you aren't particularly wild about the 20 year-olds. Believe me this, Seb: if you can bust your butt and get into good shape, you'll have no competition because a fit body is a rare thing among the 40+ crowd.
Another little factoid: By attaining a fairly low bodyfat percentage, the face also strengthens its features, attaining the type of look that is considered fairly universally handsome. Here's a dirty little secret....male models are made to work out and go on a strict diet not just to stand their with their shirt off, but to get the desired look in the face, too.

Hey...if you do decide to light a fire under your butt and get this plan going for you, I'm always available for any questions you may have. Just fire off a PM and I'll be alerted via email. I work at home, so I'm pretty much chained to this very desk for at least 8 hours 6 days a week.

Author:  acorn [ 18 Sep 2009, 15:36 ]
Post subject:  Re: official "ask ethnocide+others" thread (muscle + fitness)

just wondering if any one can help me out with this question, i weigh 77kg having lost 3kg over the last 3 weeks my BMI is 23 and im hopeing to weigh at most 70 kg by Xmas, but what is my body fat amount now, say 15%-20%-25% id love to know.
my goal for the summer of next year is to have 10% or less body fat. anyone know of a web site or forlum/RULE OF TUMB GUILDLINE I can use. Thanks

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